"I am sorry for your loss but just because a taser was used, does not mean it was the cause or even a factor. What did the coroner's report say? It's almost certain the the drugs were the cause of the strain on the heart. See my additional posts above for more information. As I mentioned before it is stastically FAR LESS likely to result in injury or death than dogs, bean bags, pepper spray or even old fashioned muscle. The taser has no effect on the heart. It has even been tested and shown to have no effect on a pace maker. It only affects skeletal muscles. A delusional, drug crazed, would-be carjacker is going to get tased every time. Thats purely by the book. It is not a toy. It is a very effective, safe tool. Period."

 

Wow. man. Are you reading what you post? Do you really believe that crap? From earlier posts it sounds to me like you think someone on drugs deserves to die.

 

You're sitting there in the privacy of your home or office telling this poor guy that his son deserved to die because he was on drugs. "I am sorry for your loss but..."

Sorry buddy, just because the company that has made millions of dollars off this product says it's safe doesn't mean it is!

You need to do some research before you post away on various blogs. People might mistaken assume you are even close to correct and further spread misinformation. “Electrical impulses” is not just some catch-all term. There is a significant amount more to it. The reason the taser does NOT affect the heart is because of the very low wattage and shape of the pulse. It only affects skeletal muscles and evidenced by countless tests, including on older subjects with pacemakers. You really need to read my two posts above. 

Have you seen “all the demonstrations” in order to accurately make the comment that they only use larger, younger individuals? Have you even seen one used in person? For you to have the opinion you do, I would doubt you have. Not only have I seen it and used it myself, I have also been tased along with the other 50+ academymates of varying levels of fitness and age. The only common factor among the “victims” was to laugh and say “Wow, that really works” while immediately getting up and continuing on with class.

drugs my @ss. Electrical impulses is how our bodies work. Shocking people with high levels can cause your heart to stop the same way it is used to start it again. Any nurse can tell you that. Also saying your certain the drugs were the cause without even knowing what drugs?

Calling it a safe tool is kind of funny. All the demonstrations you see for these devices always have huge men getting shocked, not kids, or old people.

I am sorry for your loss but just because a taser was used, does not mean it was the cause or even a factor. What did the coroner's report say? It's almost certain the the drugs were the cause of the strain on the heart. See my additional posts above for more information. As I mentioned before it is stastically FAR LESS likely to result in injury or death than dogs, bean bags, pepper spray or even old fashioned muscle. The taser has no effect on the heart. It has even been tested and shown to have no effect on a pace maker. It only affects skeletal muscles. A delusional, drug crazed, would-be carjacker is going to get tased every time. Thats purely by the book. It is not a toy. It is a very effective, safe tool. Period.

  My 18yr old was delusional(yes,drugs) when he left the house angry.  He pushed a neighbor,asked for her car keys(she gave him some other keys that would not start the car). He then told her to call the police and tell them his name. A neighbor we've known for 10 years.  My son has never committed a crime or even had a ticket. 7 minutes after the call to police, 6 cops had him cornered, as he was hiding in a neighbors fountain.  They tased him twice while soaking wet. He was 160lbs, no weapon, no threat.  He went into cardiac arrest and died. No dogs? No bean bags? No pepper spray?  Not enough muscle? If they had just shot him in the leg he'd be alive.  Just another deadly toy to use, unecessarily.  He was a loving child and deserved to be rehabilitated.  Just poor management skills by some Keystone cops!  A very wrongful death.

Whoever wrote that America's brutality goes back to way back when, yeah, go fuck yourself.  This taser thing is actually saving lives because it's causing the stupid fucks who actually challenge cops to be put in their place without losing their lives.

Go back to wherever the hell you're from and get the fuck out of my country you commie tree-hugging stupid fucking whore.

Everything which you have listed, fact wise, as far as the resistance of the human body and overall voltage of a taser is 100% correct.  However, what you have seemingly overlooked is the overall makeup of the taser itself.

A taser is, in fact, powered by only a few AA or AAA batteries, 8 at the most.  Why is it that these batteries, which are commonly used in cd players, flash lights, small televisions and remote controls, are lethal?

Answer: they arn't.  The thing that lies within the taser itself which you have overlooked is (DADADADAAAAAAA!) transformers.  In a fit of irony, it is literally, more than meets the eye.

The transformers lie within the taser structure and allow the current from the battery source to be reformed into a higher voltage and lower amperage electric current.  Enough transformers of viable strength and power altering capability are placed within the taser body to allow for a safe electric current but an incapacitating voltage.

Just thought I'd point that out.  Also, about all of those cases reported in the news, I'd like to say this.  It is fact that the taser has been named the primary cause of death in any police case in exactly 0 (zero) cases.

All the people who put up comments about lazy cops, I have but one note.

Police officers put their lives on the line every day to catch the scum of this country and, for that matter, the rest of the world.  Do you really think that people who are out for the better good of us all would carry weapons that perform actions doing the exact opposite?  Are all cops good, no.  However, I defy you to tell me that the taser is just a way for cops to use a secret lethal-quality force on civilians.

And by the way, they don't just shoot anyone.  You have to do somethin pretty f$*&%!) stupid to get to that point in the first place.

If any of you still beleive that the taser can kill, watch any video of people being shot with a taser and going down afterwards, and tell me if they're dead on impact.  If not, which is the case, then, quite simply, you're wrong.

Why is it that no police officers have died after being tasered even though most of them who carry tasers have been shot by them. Maybe it's because prior to getting shot they didn't smoke crack or shoot heroin.

"(and on the dart tips that might have come out of the dirty trunk of a police car or someone's side holster) such as staph, bacteria, prions, viruses (like HIV,) mycoplasmas, or MRSA will be INJECTED into your bloodstream by the two darts."

 Are you serious? Have you even looked into this at all? The probes are sealed inside a single use cartridge and only after pressurized nitrogen gas propels them out are they exposed to any contaminants whilst flying through the air. There is certainly no need to paint the mental picture of some rusty fish hook some officer just dug out of an ancient tackle box.

 Have you even considered the extremely high number of lives actually SAVED by the Taser? Yeah who'da thunk right? Since the adoption of the Taser by law enforcement, deaths following uses of force have plummeted. This is because other less lethal force options (hands-on, pepper spray, and baton) are FAR MORE prone to injuries including those that result in death. This also extends to the officers themselves as they are afforded up to 21 feet from combative or potentially dangerous subjects. This doesn't even take into account any non-direct lives saved by being able to quickly end a possibly extremely volatile and dangerous situation that is escalating rapidly (like eventually being forced to use deadly force).

How many of you have actually been Tased and/or trained on its use? I am going to venture a guess and say I am the only one here. You may want to consider doing some actual research before launching off on your leftist tangent. The Taser is NOT harmful and has been attributed to ZERO deaths. It only affects the skeletal muscles and has no effect on involuntary bodily functions such as heart beat, respiration, or control of bowels or urination. It has been tested on and shown to have NO EFFECT even on subjects with pacemakers. In and independent study of the Taser's uses by law enforcement, the Taser has NEVER been shown to be responsible for ANY death. The vast majority of deaths following Taser use, are a result of the reason the subject was being Tased to begin with (excessive drug use). In fact, of all the cases, the most negative result was that in 0.1% (that's one tenth of one percent) of the time, the Coroner could not completely rule the Taser out of the cause of death.

when the police tasered u are they supposed to put it on your skin an leave a big scar an it get affected because of the taser being to close to your skin

Every picture I saw so far was of white kids but that's based on just a few snippets. Somebody got killed with a baseball bat but I heard that a "stun gun" (that's a taser)was among the weapons that were deployed in this curious bit of domestic warfare between and among youth in one relatively well off corner of America - "the beacon to the world of how life should be" (US Senator Kay Bailey ' R-Texas). The world's "failed states" and "failed societies" are so fortunate to have the noble American Exception on hand to show them the way to success....

bwong a stealth taser beneath the pulpit would be real useful for a good minister seeking to show members of his flock being thrown into convulsions and writhing on the ground in the glorious agony of religious conversion and holy salvation. Evangelical pastors could lay their hands on repentant sinners, say a little ditty, wink at their hired shooter, stand clear, and then let the Lord work his miraculous ways. Some of the new converts would not survive their conversion but they will have glimpsed heaven before their demise. Hesed after this hypothetical incident (which we all sincerely hope never occurs), your defense attorney will want to cite this Tribune article and Amnesty International reports etc. to show that you had good reason to consider yourself at risk of grievous bodily harm. In all seriousness folks, if someone busts out a taser on you run like Hell...though that can also provoke cardiac arrest for some of us. Just a hunch but I imagine tasers are used a great deal in America's racially hyper-disparate mass incarceration industry, where people are closed in and easy to zap inside the range (25 feet? article says something on that). Here in Chicago area local news tells the story of a fatal brawl (1 or 2 nights ago) between suburban high schoolers (including some from North St. Charles....which I think is rather affluent; could be wrong)....

So now they're going to sell this weapon to the idiotic public. So let's say somebody points a tazer at me. What do I do? I can stand there like a dumbass and get myself fried or I can (and will) use lethal force. But what happens next? Do I get convicted because the tazer is considered "non-lethal" therefore I was never in danger of "grievous bodily harm"? I have a feeling that the answer would be, yes. Because if I were allowed to go free without charge, it would set the legal precident that the tazer is recognized as a weapon capable of causing grievous bodily harm, thus relgating it to the status of lethal weapon. Which in turn would limit the capacity of law enforcement to employ it on the scale which they currently do. This is all academic. If you want to find out how law enforcement views the tazer just ask a cop what he would do to you if you pointed a tazer at him. My guess is that you would never eat a bowl of corn flakes again. But this fact doesn't seem to be a deterrent for them to use it against you.

The real problem with tazers is that they are still considered "non-lethal", even though they often kill people. With guns, there is no question of lethality. Thus, the precidents and consequences of their use are very well defined, unlike the tazer. What are the precidents for justifying using one? What are the consequences for using one? Who knows? As a gun owner, what are my rights in using my lethal force against a possible assailant weilding a tazer? Washington State permits me as a citizen to use lethal force when faced with my own grievous bodily harm or if I witness an attempt to cause grievous bodily harm to others. There is some gray area here, but for the most part, it's pretty clear to me when I can use lethal force. With the tazer, it's ALL gray!

Well that's one possible productive spin-off into from the publicly subsidized state terror industry into the "free market." Smart advertisers will market the product in the name of "Tanya the Taser Tease." Maybe she should wear a badge.

Oops, Paul already mentioned using the taser to discipline the unruely children. But here is another idea. How about marketing the taser as a sex toy to the S & M community? TV ads will feature domintrix giving their clients a good electronic spanking with the power 50,000 orgasmo stick.

In most civilized countries what you report here would indeed be surreal. But we are talking about the U.S. of A here! In a country where any misfit can get a Uzi from the local 7/11(I am exaggerating here but not by much) the idea of civilian owning tasers is not far fetch at all. I read in a news article last year that some cops in California used their tasers on a girl because she was skipping school and smoking. Maybe soon the taser will be marketed in the Christian fundamentalist circle as a tool to discipline children.It gives new meaning to Jahovah the God of the lightning bolt. I am surprised they haven't thought of that already. Opps, actually Zeus was the God of the lightning bolt, but close enough.

Get this: when police departments get their tasers, officers go through days of training. Civilian purchasers, however, will be offered one-hour of in-person instruction and a 38 minute instructional DVD. They are free to refuse this instruction. The "Taser citizen model allows the user to stun a target for up to 30 seconds." Remember Bernard Kerik - the guy who looked like something out of Orwell's Ministry of Peace who had to step down from the Homeland Security job amidst scandal? When he was head of NYC police department, Gotham's finest bought a bunch of tasers. Kerik is (or at least was last year) a board member of Taser International. He cashed in $6 million worth of Taster stock options in 2004. Taser International says their product is safe because they did some tests in the 1990s ---- on one pig (1996) and five dogs (1999). I'm not making this stuff up. You may well not have dropped acid before you read these comments.

In spite or perhaps because of recent tragic problems with tasers used by law enforcement, the company that makes them is now undertaking a big marketing campaign to sell a consumer model (price tag is $1,000). Owners and distributers see a potentially lucrative market among the mass of fear-conditioned Amerikan herrenvolk who don't want to have to rely on the local sherrif to put 50,000 volts or more into bad guys or perhaps just into people they don't like....maybe even people in their own families. There is one known case where a taser was used by a parent on a child. How's that for a 21st-century update of the old trip to the woodshed? America's genius for technologial progress is a wonder to behold. The Tribune wonders if the taser is "going to replace the bootstrap or the belt as the preferred form of discipline by parents for children."

Today's front page Chicago Tribune story "Taser Aims At Home Market as Safety Concerns Mount" can be read at: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-0502130545feb13,1,6316677.story?coll=chi-news-hed&ctrack=1&cset=true. Apparently the Chicago police force has suspended new taser purchases in light of recent events (not just in Chicago) but it will continue to use the ones it already has at hand (around 200 in total). This article comes with shocking details on how these things work: they use a laser sight and after you pull the trigger a cartridge of compressed nitrogen gas breaks and electrodes with wires attached are shot into "the attacker." A current runs from the weapon through the wire, putting the victim on the ground in agony. There have been more than 80 taser-related deaths since 1999. Apparently Amnesty International has been trying to raise consciousness about these things and I imagine to get them banned....

I really think America's relative brutality (at least compared to other western nations) goes back to our relatively recent slave past. I have been reading the stories of people on slave plantations. Here is an interesting book written over 100 years ago by a British actress who married a slave plantation owner. She later divorced him and wrote the book. It details the brutal circumstances of the plantation. And now archaeology is uncovering the fact that there were slave plantations in the North (in Masschusetts and Long Island, for example). So brutality is woven deeply into the fabric of America. You can see this in the authoritarian attitude the media takes toward fights during sporting events. Look at the brouhaha over the NBA fights this season. THe media practically over into orbit over some brief scuffles.

NY Times article on this today. http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/12/national/12taser.html

Ok, but wouldn't even say "supporting Kerry"....my line was fire the old boss, fight the new boss. Think of it like workers in a factory. They've got the worst boss imaginable, a terrible worthless miserable super-expolitative vicious son of a bitch....a total bastard....in other words a Dubya. Does their reasonable desire to put him out make them naive supporters of the new slightly better bastard/boss (and make no mistake JFKII would have been a royal bastard like JFKI)? Does it mean they've necessarily forgotten that the real goal is to make a world without bastard bosses at all? I say no on both counts. They want the new bastard to understand they just opened up a can of political whupass on his asinine predecessor and to respect the fact of whatever power they might have. They might also reason that their freedom to work on the big and ultimate project ---- death to bosses and of human pre-history: the emergence of the era of "freely associated producers" (one of Marx's phrases) and advanced self-actualized creators ---- is somewhat improved with the milder bastard in. This is different than backlash theory, which says you actually want the worst and most dangerous SOBs in charge...because, as the German CP said in early 1930s "after Hitler, us." Well, our can didn't open far enough and the hard right protofascist ass clowns kept the White House and I'm still lashing back. On the other hand, after all this, I don't think I could make the same argument again in 08: I might think it but can't see going out on the limb with it another time because too many fellow leftists have a hard time grasping the position and so jump to unflattering conclusions if you know what I mean.

...the messianic militarist neocon thug and his vile cabal and replaced him/them with the merely neoliberal Kerry and folks around him. That was the right call (this latest stage in assault on Social Security system is part of the hard right agenda we would have done well to dodge), not pleasant, from a left anarch perspective that doesn't put all that much faith in the first place in any of the state-capitalist candidates and policymakers, in pseudo-democratic (really "polyarchic") corporate electoralism, and especially in the misbegotten American process ("the best democracy money can buy" and did buy)

Keir that's a good second observastion. At the risk of diverting from topic at hand, I'm not sure my election season rhetoric was softer...see my "Kerry's Predictable Failure to Make Bush Pay for Rising US Poverty," Dissident Voice, September 4 at http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Sept04/Street0908.htm, which went up as "Not So Sobering News" on newstand ZMagazine (October 2004). See also "Racist Democratic[Party] Atrocity Empire and Atrocity Denial," DV (9-15-04), available onlne at dissidentvoice.org/Sept04/Street0915.htm. No punches pulled and no illusions, really. And then there's my "Keynote Reflections" at http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?SectionID=33&ItemID=5951....a leftist critique of Barack Obama's heralded career-making speech. I happened to agree with Chomsky and Albert and Shalom and Zinn that the situation of many Americans, world peace, and circumstances for left organizing would be somewhat improved if we at least fired Dubya.....

According to the facts of the cases shown, it seems to me that some "supercops" really enjoy their new "toy"...