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Some thoughts on Israel, Lebanon, Gaza, imminent doom, etc.

By Justin Podur at Jul 23, 2006

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Apologies: I try to keep imminent doom out of titles, at least. But it's hard to avoid thinking about today. I have a few thoughts about the current situation in West Asia, some of which may be worth sharing. Yesterday I went to the "Stop the Attacks" demonstration in Toronto. When the Gaza attack started in earnest back in June, I went to a vigil at the Israeli Consulate in Toronto. There were less than 100 people, and I couldn't help but feel desperate that so few came out. A week later, another Gaza demonstration brought out over 300, and that was better. Between that one and yesterday's "Stop the Attacks", Israel killed about 300 Lebanese, displaced over 100,000 Lebanese, while continuing the relentless attacks and starvation of Gaza and the West Bank. Still, I was expecting about 500. In fact, there were more than 5000. Most, as far as I could tell, were Lebanese-Canadians, though of course the crowd, the flags, and the signs, were diverse, including a heavy Palestinian-Canadian contingent and many students, young people, and others. This morning I talked on the phone to a friend from London, Ontario, a town of about 100,000 some 3 hours outside Toronto. There, they had a rally of about 2-3,000 people. As the atrocities get worse and the stakes get higher, more people come out. This is, of course, very good. What would be a shame would be if we get caught, as we seem to do, in old debates and rhetorical traps that dilute our energies when they are most needed. 1) One such trap that I can see on the horizon is the question of "Supporting the Resistance". Remember that one, on Iraq? Perhaps it wasn't too important in the US. Here, it was a very divisive question, and to my mind, an entirely irrelevant one. People would ask: "Should we support the Iraqi resistance, given their use of violence and their non-progressive agenda, because they are fighting imperialism?" To me, this question betrayed a lack of understanding of the word, "support". Suppose we wanted to "support" them. What was being suggested? That we send money? Arms? Obviously not. So then, what? Try to get our governments to withdraw their actual *material* support for war, imperialism, destruction? Try to organize against our governments' military recruitment, try to organize boycotts and campaigns against war profiteers? These are the sorts of things we *could* do, if we were well-organized and serious. So, given that we *could* potentially do these things, should we *not* do them because doing them would help non-progressive elements in the Iraqi resistance? The answer to that also seems to be a fairly obvious no. So, the real question is, should we *rhetorically* support "the resistance". Some will point to their resistance and the heavy losses they have suffered, to their social programs or their potential for progressive change. Others will make sure they preface every remark on the topic with a ritual condemnation of resistance groups, their methods, their regressive actions and elements. I don't think our role is to praise or condemn resistance in other places. Our role is to praise or condemn ourselves, for changing or failing to change things we are doing in the world. I think the other questions are questions for a seminar and not for the practical work of campaigns and activism. I believe this question is going to arise over whether we should "support" Hizbullah, Hamas, and when Syria and Iran are attacked, them also. I hope that we can recognize these questions for the traps they are, relegate them to seminars, and get back to work. 2) This leads to the second point. Yesterday the march went from a logical starting point, the Israeli consulate, to a logical end point, the US consulate. Neither was coincidental. There was the slogan, "Stephen Harper, shame on you" and a poster with the PM's face and the words "War Monger" on it. I have heard otherwise reasonable people praising Harper's evacuation of Canadians from Cyprus on his plane, as if this was something other than cheap PR. Harper is vocally and materially supporting the bombers who put those Canadians in danger and killed half a dozen of them. Harper has sent Canadian soldiers off to kill and die in Afghanistan for US foreign policy goals, another act that puts Canadians at further risk of terrorist attacks. But while I have come to believe that the best actions and campaigns are ones that show knowledge and understanding of how our own society's institutions contribute to problems and work to change them, I have found that focusing on the Canadian aspects of imperialism are not as successful as focusing on the US. Canada is rapidly moving in all the wrong directions, just as events are spiraling dangerously. Should Canadians focus on Canada's role in the world? I think so, but I haven't been able to determine whether this is an effective strategy. 3) Another seminar question that has the potential to divert us is the business of whether the tail wags the dog or vice-versa. Some think Israel is a tool in the hands of the US. Others say that Israel uses its lobby to control the US - proponents of this latter position are often accused of anti-semitism. You can see that I am using the rhetorical trick of positioning myself in the reasonable middle, though I'm a little closer to the former position. I think that Israel and the US share so much economically, politically, and ideologically that they, and their interests, cannot really be separated out. Canada has moved, especially since the mid-1990s, to join this morass of interconnected interests. Organizing and educating against these interests is a major task, one that CUPE-Ontario has taken on, among others. If it were just a matter of the lobby, they could be out-lobbied. Because it isn't, there is a need to build significant public opposition. Because the media and political class is so deeply racist, especially on this issue (see Dan Freeman-Maloy's latest media analysis for a sense of where the Canadian Media is on this), that will require a major effort, and it is important not to underestimate it. The context demands a lot of activist energy, and the energy seems to be building. The consequences of diluting it and dissipating it in unproductive ways will be severe.

Comment On This Blog Post  See All Comments (22)

Person

i know better !!!

By Naderhajjar, Nader at Nov 13, 2006 21:38 PM

being from lebanon makes me  much more experienced of what's happening here  ..   kidnaping 2 isreal soldies  from the lebanese land  to trade them with the lebanese prisonned in isreal  isnt in fact a good reason to start a war wich in it childrens were killed and inoscent people died  because of isreal . huzbollah responded to the isreal bombing of lebanon dont they have the right ??  i disagree with hizbullah politicly and with syria too but  when it comes to defend my country i will proudly do it ...  thousands of lebanese people were killed and injured  houses were destroyed it was something horrible . just because hizbullah kidnaped two isreal soldiers . u tell me if its fair and if defending his country is wrong !!! and i want to add another thing  , palestines are killed everyday by the isreal forces isn't an act of terrorism ? .  and another thing , the united states gave israel the bombs  and those bombs  was used on the lebanese people and killed them . now u tell me why arabs hate US . in iraq 650 000 are dead so far . for what ??!!! for democracy!! i dont think so  maybe for OIL MARKET !! .  by the way 3 relatives of mine died .. u want 2 know why ??  because united sates wanted to give isreal more time to finish the job in lebanon with hizbollah . maybe once us dont use the VITO to clear isreal of everything  like the things she's doin in palestine now and she's done in lebanon !  .

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Person

re please do not dodge my questions..

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 28, 2006 00:32 AM

Israel is never condemned? Is this a bad joke? Do I need to show you the dozens upon dozens of UN resolutions condemning Israel?

When Iraq was condemned about breaching resolutions, it got bombed and occupied; this was more a condemnation. Also i don't see
any economic sanctions that would punish israelis..

At the same time, there are almost no condemnations of any other country. Check into these facts and let me know. Even if you think Israel is worse, please answer my question:

There is more reports and news about the middle-east, it does not mean that the UN is anti-semitic.

Do you agree sending rockets indiscriminantly into Israeli towns is a war crime? Children (including Arab children) have been killed by these rockets. if this is not a war crime, then tell me why.

Its definetely a crime and a no-no, it is also a no-no not to want negotiations.

Also, please agree or disagree with the statement that the Russians engaged in war crimes.

Russian actions with chenya were motivated by a russian oil control drive.

Do not dodge this question. I agree that Russian actions have no relationship to Israeli actions. The point is that I question why Israel is always condemned and why Russia is never condemned.
Why do you think this is? Also, do you condemn China's occupation of Tibet? Yes or no.

Yes I condenm this occupation , this occupation was probably motivated by paranoia or a fear of Western influences.

I agree that Chinese actions have no relationship to Israeli actions. The point is that I question why Israel is always condemned and why China is never condemned. Why do you think this is? Are Palestinians more important that Tibetans?

Tibetans and palestinian do not seem to have same coverage, I think tibetan cultures is of vast importance because of its advanced medicinal knowledge.

My point is that I am not here to defend Israel. My question is why so much zeal, attention, UN condemnations, blogs, etc. to Israel and only a fraction of attention to Russia, China, Darfur, etc. The number of dead, wounded, insulted, occupied, etc. is many many times greater in these situations than with Israel. I ask again, why so much attention?

may be because of coverage, you can be assured that many people complains about conditions, regardless it is not a reason why palestinian legitimates grievances should stop complaining.

there is a thing you must admit palestinians need help, and many palestinians request help. Israel also need help resolving
this, for so long it tried to resolve the issue with military might avoiding negotiations. Its a failure not only to Israel and palestinian but also to the world community. An international force should be put in place and a viable agreement should be negotiated by independant parties to resolve this conflict. You must realizes this; not wanting to negotiate tantamount to an act of war..

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Person

Disagreement with your first point

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 23, 2006 01:54 AM

I agree that both Israel and the Hezbollah/Hamas forces arrayed against them have legitamate greivances and have both committed heinous acts of desperation in order to drive those convictions home. Assigning fault is no longer a task of any credible or significant worth after over half a century of ongoing combat, but the situation is Iraq is recent enough with sufficient evidence to make a proper recognition of which parties in the conflict are making actual contributions to the future of the Iraqi people.

 

Simply read through the personal account by Jill Caroll, who was abducted by an Iraqi insurgent cell. It is fairly unbiased given her very direct persepective and shows that while the members of these insurgent cells are as human as the Iraqis we are trying to help, they are nowhere near the individuals anyone would want leading the nation.

 

The insurgents in Iraq are not resistance or members of a formerly legitamate government. They are motivated by the short-sighted and incredibly unrealistic goals of driving out both the Shiite majority and American military to set up a theocracy that is currently only supported by less than 5 percent of the population. Even Saddam Hussein knew well enough to keep Iraq secular if he was to maintain order.

 

What is worse is that these goals are not underscored by any semblance of social or political organization as is the case with Hamas or Hezbollah, which is another debate entirely, but are only accomplished through pure bloodshed and indiscriminate targeting of friendly civilians, unaffiliated police officers, and non-American foreigners. The simple fact is that they are not resisting anything but the inevitable decisions Iraq must make.

 

It is fairly obvious that Iraq will not be the model client state of American interests like Japan was and that it will retain its rugged brand of Islam to spite its own jealous neighbors. The sad fact is that the only way to win in a long-term state of hostility against terrorists or enemies who utilize guerilla tactics is to simply maintain a presence despite the casualties it causes.


Despite the American retreat in Vietnam, it succeeded in blunting the spread of Communism beyond Cambodia and Saigon which really showed the success of the American policy then - containment. The problem is that communism had the palpable face of totalitarianism while the current terrorists hide in the minority of a minority of Islam striking not at a time of the West's choosing. The only way to reverse the tide of poverty, violence, and desperation in the Middle East is through the slow and polite spread of culture and economy, not weapons.

 

While this is a lesson the current administration is learning despite their many shortcomings, it will be one the insurgents in Iraq will never learn because it is the core of the existence of a cell. They fight for no cause than imagined glory, kill for no cause other than elementary school-style rhetoric and will fall when the standard of living in Iraq begins to improve. Then the insurgents will not be seen as resistance by Iraqis but a tiny roadblock on their way to true progress.

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Person

I don't disagree with you.....up to a point

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 14, 2006 14:16 PM

I agree that a desire to help palestinians or to find acceptable solution for palestinians is NOTanti-semitic. The problem lies that for too many people and organizations (like the UN) the obsessive criticism and demonization of all actions by Israel, to the EXCLUSION of criticizing any other nation becomes anti-semitic.

For the UN, the Human Rights just finished its meeting on June 30 2006. On its final day, the Council passed just ONE resolution condemning human-rights violations by any of the 192 U.N. members, and directed it at Israel. When it was all over, the Council decided to hold its first special (emergency) session within a few days — on Israel.

In Darfur, there are three quarters of a million people beyond humanitarian reach, 2.5 million people displaced by the violence, 385,000 people in immediate risk of starvation, and over two million dead in 22 years of violence and deprivation. But it wasn't genocide in Sudan that interested the Human Rights Council. Nor was it a billion Chinese without civil and political rights, or the brutal occupation of Tibet. Not 13 million women in Saudi Arabia whose lives depend on hiding from sight in public places and never being caught behind the wheel of an automobile. Not the dire human-rights conditions of 23 million people in North Korea. Not Iranian President Ahmadinejad's incitement to genocide or his country's legal system, which includes crucifixion, stoning and amputation. DO YOU NEED MANY MORE EXAMPLES ? (zimbabwe, burma, chechnya............)

So I am not here to defend Israel or to say that criticism of israel is anti-semitism. But I ask you, if you are really a defender of human rights, don't you think it is strange that the main UN body that protects human rights has only condemned ONE country for human rights violations. And this is recurring, not just this year. The obsession by many "human rights defenders" with Israel, with the complete and obvious exclusion of criticism of other nations is the issue. THIS my friend, is anti-semitism.

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Person

Please answer my questions, you are dodging them

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 14, 2006 14:04 PM

Israel is never condemned? Is this a bad joke? Do I need to show you the dozens upon dozens of UN resolutions condemning Israel? At the same time, there are almost no condemnations of any other country. Check into these facts and let me know.

Even if you think Israel is worse, please answer my question: Do you agree sending rockets indiscriminantly into Israeli towns is a war crime? Children (including Arab children) have been killed by these rockets. If this is not a war crime, then tell me why.

Also, please agree or disagree with the statement that the Russians engaged in war crimes. Do not dodge this question. I agree that Russian actions have no relationship to Israeli actions. The point is that I question why Israel is always condemned and why Russia is never condemned. Why do you think this is?

Also, do you condemn China's occupation of Tibet? Yes or no. I agree that Chinese actions have no relationship to Israeli actions. The point is that I question why Israel is always condemned and why China is never condemned. Why do you think this is? Are Palestinians more important that Tibetans?

My point is that I am not here to defend Israel. My question is why so much zeal, attention, UN condemnations, blogs, etc. to Israel and only a fraction of attention to Russia, China, Darfur, etc. The number of dead, wounded, insulted, occupied, etc. is many many times greater in these situations than with Israel. I ask again, why so much attention?

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Person

I failed to see..

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 13, 2006 19:29 PM
Anonymous, I failed to see where my desire to help palestinians or to find acceptable solution for palestinians becomes anti-semite.. In this case I see a need for intervention and condemnation because Israel is abusing a people; in its current form Isarel is a monstruosity, you only have to look at the palestinian condition to be confronted with the truth.. I am in Canada, we do not threat our minorities like this.

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Person

taking it further

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 13, 2006 19:18 PM

Would you agree that Hezbollah is also engaging in infanticide and murder of innocent Israelis (both Israeli Jews and Arabs). If you need examples I will show you the articles. Do you agree sending rockets indiscriminantly into Israeli towns is a war crime? Do you agree that Hezbollah should thus be subject to worldwide condemnation (just like you think Israel deserves).

Hizbollah uses restraint when compared to Israel.. Hizbollah is condemned Israel is never condemned, did you see an Israeli on trial somewhere? the state of israel deserve to be reshaped.

Next, would you agree that Russia's destruction of Grozny in Chechnya in the late 1990s and into the 2000s also constituted infanticide and war crimes. Do you need evidence of literally 100,000+ people killed and an entire city turned into rubble?

Russia had its own plan for oil domination. its not because russia murder arabs that it gives a free ticket to israel to do same.

Do you condemn China's occupation of Tibet as strongly as you condemn or ever condemned Israel's occupation of West Bank/Gaza?

I condemn Zionism for the whole occupation of Palestine.

Do you need evidence of the repression of Tibetan culture with a Dalai Lama who is in exile? I don't.

Finally, are you willing to use the word "infanticide" for US actions in Iraq. I am sure 100s of children/infants were killed by US actions.

I am more willing , the US does not look or think twice before sending 1000 lbs bombs.

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Person

Let's take it a but further

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 07, 2006 10:09 AM

OK fine. You do use much stronger terms against Israel, so answer these questions for me:

Would you agree that Hezbollah is also engaging in infanticide and murder of innocent Israelis (both Israeli Jews and Arabs). If you need examples I will show you the articles. Do you agree sending rockets indiscriminantly into Israeli towns is a war crime? Do you agree that Hezbollah should thus be subject to worldwide condemnation (just like you think Israel deserves).

Next, would you agree that Russia's destruction of Grozny in Chechnya in the late 1990s and into the 2000s also constituted infanticide and war crimes. Do you need evidence of literally 100,000+ people killed and an entire city turned into rubble?

Do you condemn China's occupation of Tibet as strongly as you condemn or ever condemned Israel's occupation of West Bank/Gaza? Do you need evidence of the repression of Tibetan culture with a Dalai Lama who is in exile?

Finally, are you willing to use the word "infanticide" for US actions in Iraq. I am sure 100s of children/infants were killed by US actions.

If you agree with my points, although I may disagree with you about Israel, I would agree that you are not being anti-semitic. If you don't agree with my points, I would be curious about how you justify these crimes by other countries and why they don't get condemned in as harsh a language as you use for Israel. My main issue is that I often see tremendous zeal to condemn Israel, while the crimes in the rest of the world are virtually ignored by these "human rights activists."

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Person

ok.. I go with your standard

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 05, 2006 14:31 PM
The attack of Lebanon by Israel display zionism complete disregard for human life and its ongioing war policy constitutes another infanticide of arabs children. The US invasion and occupation of Iraq display neocons complete disregard for human life in general and is a good exmaple of US imperial ambition for a control of oil market.. There see ? I didn't single out Israel only, I singled out the US too. Because I single out the US prevents this post or me of being anti-semitic.. The US also provide WMDs to Israel and Israel is "moderately" massacring the Lebanese with the provided WMDs. Israel is being very careful when it is deliberately targeting and murdering civilians that are often labeled terrorists.. Lebanese people should not protest being trown WMDs because his protest could be perceived as anti-semitic, a Lebanese father's anger when loosing a child should blame the palestinian people because the death of his children is related to palestinians houses being bulldozed by zionism ideology.. Bad palestinians they refused to vote for the zionist one that deny palestinians their own land.. Hizbollah is also bad because it refuses to abandon Palestinians and this against Israel and the US expansionists policies and I am also bad because I refuses to abandon Palestinians in the hands or torturers.. you win, i didnt say anything anti-semitic.

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Person

When is criticism of Israel considered anti-semitic?

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 03, 2006 17:05 PM

 

Criticism of Israel is certainly not anti-semitic. I have much to disagree with in their policies and actions (like I do with many countries). However, ONLY criticizing Israel, or obsessively criticizing Israel while ignoring all actions of all other countries and parties IS anti-semitism. For this reason, the UN is an anti-semitic organization as a whole. The number of resolutions against Israel number in the DOZENS, dwarfing that of any other country. While countries like China (occupying Tibet since the 1950's, destroying Tibetan culture – do you disagree?), Russia (didn't they DESTROY Grozny in Chechnya killing 1000s -- do you disagree?), Egypt (repressive dictatorship, jailing journalists, opposition parties, and much more – do you disagree?) and many more are entirely ignored by the UN. For example, in 2003 the UN called only 3 emergency sessions, all to criticize Israel (not Sudan, not Zimbabwe, etc.). As if the whole rest of the world were at peace. Do I need to mention the dozens of places where 100s of people are dying every day due to some government's actions? Note that I am not necessarily disputing the criticism of Israel. But the fact that Israel gets singled out is anti-semitism. Do you want to call Israel's actions in Lebanon a war crime? Well, let's at least hear you call Hezbollah's actions a war crime (shooting rockets at civilian targets, with the sole purpose of killing civilians, including some Arab children). If you don't say Hezbollah is committing war crimes and ONLY say Israel is, then this is anti-semitism.

 

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Person

I guess you believe Egypt won the 1967 and 1973 wars also

By Kissenger, Clark at Aug 03, 2006 16:35 PM
I guess if you use Middle Eastern and certain Asian sources for your news, you are right, the kidnapped soldiers were in Israel. If you choose to listen to 98% of newspapers in the US, Europe and elsewhere, if you listen to UN officials, European leaders (including France, never one to hesitate to criticize Israel), nearly all new channels, it is clear that Hezbollah kidnapped 2 soldiers that were IN ISRAEL and at the same time launched rockets at Israeli towns (A WAR CRIME under any definition). And just because Israel was prepared to respond to fight Hezbollah, including detailed battle plans, DOES NOT mean Israel started this war. After 6 years of arms buildup, Israel would have to be really stupid to not plan for a possible war. Using the news sources you cite, you probably believe that Egypt won the 1973 war (they still celebrate a victory of this war!), that Jews drink the blood of Christians on Passover, and that the Jews control the world economy.

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Person

Rudy and magnifying glasses

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 28, 2006 00:20 AM
Rudy, i don't know if you glasses are thick as Ronald Rumsfeld but if you uses magnifying glasses you'll see Ayta ash Shab inside the Lebanese land.. ( lost ? I am surprised you didnt say they were doing a pilgrinage..)

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Person

http://www.hindustantimes.co

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 27, 2006 14:10 PM

http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1742306,00050004.htm

Hezbollah movement announced on Wednesday that its guerrillas have captured two Israeli soldiers in southern Lebanon.

 

http://english.bna.bh/?ID=47348

The Lebanese Hezbollah movement announced Wednesday the arrest of two Israeli soldiers in southern Lebanon.
Lebanese police said that the two soldiers were arrested as they entered the town of Aitaa al-Chaab inside the Lebanese border.

http://en.chinabroadcast.cn/2947/2006/07/12/191@113428.htm

The militant group Hezbollah said it captured two Israeli soldiers during clashes across the border in southern Lebanon on Wednesday.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/HG15Ak02.html

It all started on July 12 when Israel troops were ambushed on Lebanon's side of the border with Israel.

The other links demonstrate that Israel had prepared this operation more than a year in advance in the case of the slightest provocation.  If the soldiers were indeed "Lost" Lebanon still retains the right to detain them by virture of the fact that they are illegally in Lebanese territory.  Also see "Lebanon detains 36 spy suspects" which says they were detained during an ATTACK.

Looks like Lebanese territory to me.  Hezbollah undoubtedly did violate Israeli territory, in retaliation for Israli incoursions.  As I said earlier, Hezbollah is guilty of terrorism, but so is Israel.  If this isn't terrorism, what is: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5219360.stm. 

David Barouski.

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Person

How is your reading

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 27, 2006 12:13 PM
How is your reading comprehension? Of the mainstream links you posted, none mentioned the Israeli soldiers being in Lebanon and two mentioned a Hezbollah arms build up prior to these events and a SUBSEQUENT Israeli troop build up. The one Asian and one Arab press you linked to stated the Sheba farms area is disputed. That area is only disputed by Hezbollah. The UN and the international community recognize that territory as Israeli. One of those sources also said two Israeli troops entered a Lebanese town. Are two troops going to attack and conquer a whole town? It sounds more like they were lost. Lost troops happens all the time on the South and North Korean border. That doesn't mean an invasion. Further, Koffi Anan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia have all said Hezbollah violated Israeli territorial integrity. If you're going to "side with" terrorists and those who want to kill people of a different religion based on emotion and not fact, fine. Just say so so we know what we're dealing with.

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Person

Fact Checking

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 27, 2006 01:36 AM
London's current population is about 380,000 and ever growing (homo sapiens is like a cancer). The point being, if you got that one wrong, it calls into disrepute all of the other numbers you quoted.

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Person

Newspapers

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 26, 2006 23:02 PM

Zionism is indeed the belief in Israel as the true home of the Jews, but you forgot to mention that the Israel (or Zion as it is called) mentioned in the Torah includes not only the present area of Israel, but also Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, and a large part of both Iran and Saudi Arabia.  It is actually referred to now as the "Greater Israel." 

Here are some newspapers that reported on the soldiers being captured in Lebanon and also about Israeli illegal incoursions into Lebanon before the soldiers were captured to get you started.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/hezbollah_soldiers.html

http://english.bna.bh/?ID=47348

http://en.chinabroadcast.cn/2947/2006/07/12/191@113428.htm

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/07/21/MIDEAST.TMP&type=printable

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?c=JPArticle&cid=1150885978380&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

http://www.voltairenet.org/article142056.html

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/HG15Ak02.html

These papers show the whole world doesn't refute that.  Lastly, how can you justify saying that the Congolese support Hezbollah by allowing Lebanese immigrants to open businesses there?  I can tell you having been there that many of them have no idea who Hezbollah even is, let alone support them.  Are you stating that, by allowing Lebanese into the country to open a business, they are supporting Hezbollah?  With that line of thinking, supporting any Lebanese business person regardless of their religous beliefs is supporting Hezbollah, never mind the large Christian population that lives there.  Are you stating all Lebanese in Congo are affiliated with Hezbollah?  How can you make such a generalization?  How does Congolese culture specifically support Hezbollah?

Lastly, criticizing Israel is hardly criticizing all Jews, it is a statement against Zionist policy, which hardly represents the majority of Jews.  As Colin Powell said, "It is not Anti-Semitic to criticize the policies of Israel."

 

David Barouski

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Person

Zionism is the belief that

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 26, 2006 22:10 PM

Zionism is the belief that Israel is the Jewish homeland. To argue anything different is pure ignorance.

And typically, the socialist response is the anti-Jewish sentiment is the fault of the Jews because of... it's not important why, it just is.

I would also like to know what newspaper said the Israeli soldiers captured by Hezzbolah were in Lebanon.  The entire world - including the Arab world - refutes that.  Except, apparently, those on the left who will demonize Israel and Jews at all costs, even at the cost of the truth. 

For the person who just got back from the Congo, you can tell them this is what their culture gets for supporting groups like Hezzbolah.   

 

 

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Person

Think about this....

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 26, 2006 21:17 PM
There is a fundamental difference between Anti-Semitism (all Jews) and Anti-Zionism.  Zionism itself is a new religon only rising to prominence in the 1940s following World War 2 led by people like Israel's first prime minister David Ben Gurion.  Many Orthodox Jews feel Zionism is a false religion because it worships the state of Israel, not Yahweh or the Torah's word.  I urge everyone to watch the Israeli embassy in the United States.  Every so often, thousands of Jews will line up outside it and protest Zionism and the policies of Israel and the United States.  Watch whenever there is a JINSA conference.  Same thing, though the media will ignore it.  I am not stating that the Arab states are blameless, I'm only saying that Israel is the instigator a lot more times than many people realize.

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The Devil is happy..

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 26, 2006 20:13 PM
The devil is happy innocent lebaneses died with the bombing.. Nice post Justin and David.. Justin next time you have a march, email me, Ill get some video gear and I won't mind just to "fan the flames for our palestinian brothers and sisters". Be also nice to have some archives..

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Anti-Semitism Card

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 26, 2006 19:26 PM

Wasn't long before it was played.  Don't forget that the captured Israeli soldiers that sparked the inital attack were captured IN LEBANON carrying out illegal cross border operations.  Israel has targeted civilian and infrastructural targets having nothing to do with Hezbollah or the Lebanese army.  Check the photos, the same weapons the US accused Saddam Hussein of having are being used by the IDF to deliver illegal phosphorus weapons in Lebanon.  The US is also currently giving satellite imagery to help Israel target its strikes, which recently included an "accidental" attack on a UN HQ that was fired at 14 times.  The attack was planned at the American Enterprise Institute summit in early June in Colorado which was attended by former Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Likud Knesset member Natan Sharansky, and Dick Cheney.  The whole so-called "Kill the Jews" strategy wouldn't have become as prominent in Iran or Lebanon if the US hadn't removed Mossadek in the 50s and installed the Shah, who was so oppressive that his regime paved the way for the Iranians to accept Ayatollah Khomeni as their leader, who sowed the anti-American and Anti-Israeli roots in the Shiite people like never before.  This is called "Blowback" in CIA terms.  So what did the CIA do to stop Khomeni?  They gave Saddam the military means to fight the Iranians in their war.  And it goes on and on.....and the US isn't interested in a cease fire.

 I just returned from the Congo.  There are many Lebanese business owners in Kinshasa and Kisangani.  The day the strikes began on Beirut, I was at a Lebanese owned restaraunt with my friend.  I will never forget watching the Lebanese family that owned the business sitting at the table holding hands, glued to the TV set showing CNN Europe over the satellite while their hometown was being systematically destroyed by Israel, which is given 3 billion + in aid from my country every year, not to mention being sold American armaments, tanks, etc.  I had no idea what to say to them.  I still don't.  I can only give my most deepest sympathies and soldiarity in suffering for the innocent civilians of this latest violence.

 

David Barouski. 

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Person

It looks like...

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 24, 2006 15:21 PM
...we have a winner!!!

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Person

Any support NOT directed

By Kissenger, Clark at Jul 23, 2006 20:43 PM
Any support NOT directed towards Israel is anti-semitic. You fail to acknowledge that primary underlying philophy which behind this war plain and simple: Kill the Jews. That is exactly why Saudi Arabia and Egypt have told Syria to cut it out and why someone needs to say the same thing to their Persian neighbors. The fact is, groups that have as a core believe of "The Jews must be killed," have provoked this controversy from the start. In this most recent flair up, Hezzbolah has been planing this attack for years. And now, they aren't afraid to die. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060724/ap_on_re_mi_ea/lebanon_israel Of course none of that matter to those who state that Jews have no claim to their homeland. While you stand up and call the U.S. fascist and imperialist, you conviently forget that the Baath parties of Syria and Iraq owe their ideological allegiance to the National Socialists of Germany. I can only guess you don't mention this because the socialist family does not want to air its dirty laundry. It's odd that those who call themselves socialist, who supposedly fight for the downtrodden, so badly want the Jews to be oppressed. How easily the socialists forget their Jewish roots.

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