What we need is a feral howl
Arundhati Roy Interviewed by Christina Patterson
Roy says: 'I walk a very thin line between retaining my space as a writer and people expecting me to be some 'leader', which I simply am not.'
The year before its second nuclear tests, the world's largest democracy hurled a bomb onto the international stage. At first, people didn't realise it was a bomb. It was tiny, looked harmless and took a while to explode. But explode it did and the world's largest democracy is still reeling. Or perhaps we should say "democracy". Perhaps, in fact, we should say "heavily sponsored, TV-friendly spectator sport".
The bomb, of course, was Arundhati Roy, the fragile-looking beauty from Kerala whose whimsical tale of two-egg twins and pickles, literal and metaphorical, bagged the Booker and set the world on fire. For India, this was confirmation that theirs was a land rich in saleable exports: photogenic, charming and home-grown. No hooded eyes or fatwas here; no unseemly flight to London or New York. Here was glamour, here was grace, here was huge-eyed modesty in a sari. This was the face of the new India: sophisticated, educated, funny and – did we mention this? – drop-dead gorgeous.
"I have truly known," wrote Roy the year after her Booker win, "what it means for a writer to feel loved." She was, she added, "one of the items being paraded in the media's end-of-the-year National Pride Parade". I don't think she would be now. Her comments were made in an essay, "The End of Imagination", written in August 1998, three months after those nuclear tests. She had dreamed, she wrote, after her "five minutes" of fame, of growing "old and irresponsible", eating "mangoes in the moonlight" and maybe writing a couple of "worstsellers" to "see what it felt like". All this was blown apart. "There can be nothing more humiliating," she wrote, "for a writer of fiction to have to do than restate a case that has already been made." She did it anyway. She had, she felt, to write about the apocalyptic folly of a government that found displays of nuclear-fuelled nationalism more of a priority than educating its 400 million illiterate inhabitants.
And so the new Arundhati Roy was born, the Arundhati Roy described, often with an air of bemusement, as a "writer-activist" (a label she said made her think of a sofa-bed), the Arundhati Roy who hacked off her flowing locks and hacked off India's ruling classes. After that first blistering denunciation of India's attempt to "be admitted into the club of Superpowers", she found she couldn't stop. The following year she started campaigning on behalf of the one million- odd people whose homes, and livelihoods, were threatened by the massive Narmada dam project. Since then, she has written about the American response to 9/11, the war in Afghanistan, and now, in Listening to Grasshoppers: Field Notes on Democracy, the dark heart of the world's largest democracy, its corruption, double-speak and neo-fascism. "You know how it is," she writes in the introduction, "the Chinese do Sport, so they had the Olympics; India does Democracy, so we had an election." Which gives you a taste of the tone.
What you don't get in the writing – passionate, searing and often witty – is the anarchic spirit that bubbles below the surface, the sudden bursts of laughter, the sometimes wicked smile. Her peculiar outfit – flowery turquoise jacket coupled with voluminous grey harem pants made by a local tailor who's an alcoholic – might have Trinny and Susannah screeching in horror, but it can't hide her beauty. Neither can her slightly wild, scraped-back-with-a-hairband-and-now-streaked-with-grey hair. "I had my photo taken on this chair yesterday," she says, as I gasp at the fluorescent green colour scheme in Penguin's meeting room. She's probably the only writer who could carry it off.
She is also one of the only writers to have hit international stardom with fiction that won plaudits for its winsome playfulness and to have eschewed it, for more than a decade, for deadly serious polemic. "I worry," she says in the introduction to Listening to Grasshoppers "that I am allowing myself to be railroaded into offering prosaic, factual precision when maybe what we need is a feral howl, or the transformative power and real precision of poetry." Actually, Roy's non-fiction is something like a "feral howl". It's something like poetry, too. It's clear, ruthless, blazing, as compelling as fiction, and as precise (at least at moments) as poetry. Did she have any models when she started?
"No," she says. "I was just this fairy princess of the rising Indian middle class and then the nuclear tests happened and it was obvious to me that keeping quiet was as political as saying something. It was the first act of stepping into a space where I was willing to come in for media attack." You can say that again. If the media went mad, the authorities went ballistic. Following a court case (on charges so surreal that they would, in other circumstances, be funny) that lasted a year, she was sent to jail. The sentence was three months, but she was released, after paying a fine, after a day. It was, in fact, her third court case. The first arose from a critique she wrote about Shekhar Kapur's film The Bandit Queen and the second from that enchanting (and, you'd have thought, harmless) Booker bestseller. Was it a shock to discover how powerful a writer could be?
"When I decided to write The God of Small Things, I had been working in cinema," she explains. "It was almost a decision to downshift from there. I thought that 300 people would read it. But it created a platform of trust. This," she says, pointing at the new book, "is about saying 'let's distribute this piece of writing as a weapon so that everybody can understand it'... Years of imprisoning and beheading writers never succeeded in shutting them out. However, placing them in the heart of a market and rewarding them with a lot of commercial success, has."
Certainly, there's nothing like a bit of material success to blunt the hunger of many an artist for the end of capitalism, and Roy, as a successful writer who is also (let's not beat about the bush) extremely rich, has attracted attacks for letting the side down. She has learnt how to deal with it. "You're not," she says, "some innocent who goes out thinking everybody's going to stand up and clap and say 'oh, how wonderful'. It's not about reviews and ratings. This political writing, in India, is translated into so many languages and published in little pamphlets. It has an informal and radical life of its own which I value more than anything else in the world."
The value, it's clear, comes from the knowledge that she speaks for the silent, powerless (and often illiterate) majority in a country where "creating a good investment climate" is the new euphemism for "third world repression". And she knows about poverty, too. When her alcoholic, Bengali Hindu father left the family home when she was two, her Keralite Syrian Christian mother struggled to provide for her family. Eventually, she started a school, where Roy was her chief helper. At 16, she left Kerala for Delhi, living in a small hut with a tin roof and earning her living by selling empty beer bottles. Later, she studied architecture, met her film-maker husband, Pradip Krishen and moved into films and fiction. But the taste of poverty, and its impotence, has never left her.
It must be thrilling, of course, to speak on behalf of so many millions, but it must be a dizzying responsibility, too. Does it ever feel like a burden? For a moment, Roy's dainty features look stricken. "I walk a very thin line between retaining my space as a writer," she says, "and people expecting me to be some 'leader', which I simply am not. As a writer, I want to reserve the right not to fulfil people's expectations... I spent the early part of my life unhitching myself from the traditions of my community and wanting to be in a city and smoke dope. The middle class thinks that an activist should wear a hand-loomed sari and behave well. What if I don't want to behave well?"
Oh good. Here's the spiky, abrasive, tricky Arundhati Roy, the one who can do girlish charm, but prefers to speak her mind, the one who has, in the past, fiercely resisted the label "nice". Why does she resist it so strongly? Her answer, like all her answers, is a perfectly crafted mini essay. The gist of it is that non-violent movements in India have been marginalised and are now turning into armed struggles, and that while she is "not about to" condone them, neither is she about to condemn them. Well, sure, but isn't it partly just the deep-seated rebelliousness that has, clearly, been there from childhood?
Roy smiles. "I think that there are people who are comfortable with power and there are people who automatically start arguing again," she says. "There's so much bile and yet I've become very cool about it. I just laugh and think 'what's dissent without a few good insults?'. In fact, after the Mumbai attacks, before I wrote about it, there was already a letter in Outlook saying 'oh God, I'm dreading what she's going to write'. But frankly," she adds, "it's not important what type of person I am."
Well, I plead, it is for me. "If I were talking to you having written a novel," she concedes, "I might have been more comfortable talking about myself, but now it's almost like I hesitate to claim authorship of this because it's about so many people." Yes, yes, the silent millions etc, but Arundhati Roy is not silent, and the reason TV cameras follow her from one protest to the next is because of her – sorry, but we have to use the word – celebrity. "But celebrity for what?" she says. "As a writer, it's not for anything else." Er, no. And your point is?
And so our (well-mannered) fight goes on. When I ask if we're doomed, she talks to me about bauxite. When I say that the non-violent resistance in relation to the dams failed, she tells me that "there have been victories and some defeats". When I ask about Obama, she says that America is "not negotiating with the world because of Obama but because its economy has collapsed". And when I ask her what she does with her money, she tells me, but won't let me write it down. Suffice it to say, it does not go on bling.
And then, in case I think she's some kind of saint, fighting for the poor and living like Mother Theresa, she tells me that she lives in "a nice place" (apart from her husband, with whom she has a "happy, anarchic" relationship) and that she spends a lot of her time just "hanging out with friends". "For me," she says, "that means everything. I really worry about these political people that have no personal life. If there's nothing that's lovely, and if there's nothing that's just ephemeral, that you can just lie on the floor and bust a gut laughing at, then what's the point?"
What's the point indeed? Oh, and did I mention that Arundhati Roy is writing another novel? "It's about what goes on," she says, as if every other novel wasn't, "in our hearts and minds." Clearly, we'll just have to wait.
'Listening to Grasshoppers' is published by Hamish Hamilton
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Good Question
By Small, Brian at Jul 18, 2009 22:25 PM
Did she have any models when she started?
I've been wondering if Arundhati Roy was influenced by Eduardo Galeano, or the translator of his works Cedric Belfrage. I think they're soul siblings. I guess writing about power and empire with angry wit bring out a similar feeling in the reader. I could hear Roy's Come September voice saying this from page 207 of the chapter The Contemporary Structure of Plunder in Open Veins of Latin America:
The are alway politicians and technocrats ready to show the world that the invasion of "industrializing" foreign capital benefits the area invaded. In this version, the new-model imperialism comes on a genuinely civilizing mission, is a blessing to the dominated countries, and the true-love declarations by the dominant power of the moment are its real intentions. Guilty consciences are thus relieved of the need for alibis, for no one is guilty: today's imperialism radiates technology and progress, and even the use of this old, unpleasant word to define it is in bad taste. But when imperialism begins exalting its own virtues we should take a look in our pockets. We find that the new model does no make its colonies more prosperous, although it enriches their poles of development; it does not ease social and regional tensions, but aggravates them; it spreads poverty even more widely and concentrates wealth even more narrowly; it pays wages twenty times lower than in Detroit and charges prices three times higher than in New York; it takes over the internal market and the mainsprings of the productive apparatus; it assumes proprietary rights to chart the course and fix the frontiers of progress; it controls national credit and orients external trade at its whim; it denationalizes not only industry but the profits earned by industry; it fosters the waste of resources by diverting a large part of the economic surplus abroad; it does not bring in capital for development but takes it out. As various ECLA reports have shown, the hemorrhage of profits from direct US investments in Latin America has been five times greater in recent years than the infusion of new investments.
Why did the Galeano/Belfrage passage above bring to mind the Roy/Come September passage below?
Writers imagine that they cull stories from the world. I'm beginning to believe that vanity makes them think so. That it's actually the other way around. Stories cull writers from the world. Stories reveal themselves to us. The public narrative, the private narrative - they colonize us. They commission us. They insist on being told. Fiction and nonfiction are only different techniques of story telling. For reasons that I don't fully understand, fiction dances out of me, and nonfiction is wrenched out by the aching, broken world I wake up to every morning.
The theme of much of what I write, fiction as well as nonfiction, is the relationship between power and powerlessness and the endless, circular conflict they're engaged in. John Berger, that most wonderful writer, once wrote: "Never again will a single story be told as though it's the only one." There can never be a single story. There are only ways of seeing. So when I tell a story, I tell it not as an ideologue who wants to pit one absolutist ideology against another, but as a story-teller who wants to share her way of seeing. Though it might appear otherwise, my writing is not really about nations and histories; it's about power. About the paranoia and ruthlessness of power. About the physics of power. I believe that the accumulation of vast unfettered power by a State or a country, a corporation or an institution - or even an individual, a spouse, a friend, a sibling -regardless of ideology, results in excesses such as the ones I will recount here.
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farting around
By Small, Brian at Jul 18, 2009 21:52 PM
she spends a lot of her time just "hanging out with friends". "For me," she says, "that means everything. I really worry about these political people that have no personal life. If there's nothing that's lovely, and if there's nothing that's just ephemeral, that you can just lie on the floor and bust a gut laughing at, then what's the point?"
This reminded me of Kurt Vonnegut. You could make up political excused for enjoying life too though - community involvement ushers along community understanding which is crucial to any cause - think about breaking the down Mohawk Valley formula for union struggles... But why not just enjoy yourself with people and then appreciate "how nice" it is when the people you've been spending time with turn out to share the understanding underpinning social/political causes....
I tell you, we are here on Earth to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different.
Kurt Vonnegut
"farting around" might be North American Gringo for the literate Indian-from-India 'whimsical' and 'ephemeral'
This from the Guardian:
Farewell to a master of farting around
Kurt Vonnegut was one of the great playful writers - but the fun was informed by tragedy and a passion for justice
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